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Thread: Shortgaff Cockfighting

  
  1. #31
    Senior Member nonny's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by lansford101
    what i really want to see is the weapon its self and maybe some vids of gaff fights thats it
    Dont know about vids , maybe look on the net , will try to post some photo's for you in the next day or two

  2. #32
    Member 1handkneehigh's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by Sentenciador
    What are the bloodlines used in short heel? Hatch, Whitehackle, Butcher, I assume.

    Aside from gameness and cutting, what other attributes does one look for in breeding short heel fowl? I think stamina is important here? What else?

    Thank you!

    ..Up here the 1 1/4" regulation and the 1 1/8" peg awls are all we own and all we test with,we only play with the long gaffs down south..
    ..ANY GAME COCK that has power,alot of cut and alot of bottom is suitable for the short heals,but your broodpens had better produce cocks that are just as strong at the 1 hr mark as the 1st buckle or it'll be over and sad very fast..
    ..Style ?....preferebly ones that can hit the head and neck areas the most,but if not any good cutting cock can and will hit any vital that a long heal bird can..
    ..We use Miner Blues,Leipers,Greys and YLH Hatch mostly ..
    ..I can't understand how anyone could watch a short heal fight and call it boring ?

  3. #33
    Senior Member VMT^Carmen's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by 1handkneehigh
    ..Up here the 1 1/4" regulation and the 1 1/8" peg awls are all we own and all we test with,we only play with the long gaffs down south..
    ..ANY GAME COCK that has power,alot of cut and alot of bottom is suitable for the short heals,but your broodpens had better produce cocks that are just as strong at the 1 hr mark as the 1st buckle or it'll be over and sad very fast..
    ..Style ?....preferebly ones that can hit the head and neck areas the most,but if not any good cutting cock can and will hit any vital that a long heal bird can..
    ..We use Miner Blues,Leipers,Greys and YLH Hatch mostly ..
    ..I can't understand how anyone could watch a short heal fight and call it boring ?
    I think it is not boring..but can be dragging. Once the other is down..or both, you can boil your coffee and come back after tea..and nothing much had changed since you left.

    That is perhaps what they see as boring, especially those LK people where the fight burst in action under a minute and often death comes shortly thereafter.

    But for me, I don't mind. A fight is a fight, there can only be good ones ..or bad ones.

  4. #34
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by blackdeath
    Basically, in addition to the fowls you mention, all families of fowl bred the Northeastern areas of the US were fought in short heels, 1 1/4" gaffs. The Boston roundheads, brownred families such as the Kearney brownreds, John Stones, and other Irish brownred families, the Albanys, Shawlnecks. This list goes on. And yes, stamina, gameness, and power-power- power were desirable traits. I started out fighting in this heel and loved it. I was fighting Gleezen Whitehackles and the old C C Cooke Preacher Blueface. The longer the fight went, the better they got, and the better I liked it. If it went to the drag pit and my rooster was on his feet, those two old short heel families were had to beat. You had to kill every feather on them, and you didn't give up on them 'til they were dead. They could win with their dying lick. Power
    Preacher Hatch. Im close friends with the man who started that line of chickens. He still raises them. His brothers are dark/light red, his come lemonhackle all straight comb. They weren't blueface though. Story goes they're a stolen family of brood pen 37 (37 or 17 I cant remember) from Sandy Hatch. If I remember the story correctly someone stole the birds from Duke Husley when he took over Hatch's farm. The took the family of birds and walked them at a preachers farm. The Preacher gave away the stags to Jerry because they were killing each other. Jerry then went back and got the rest of the what he had.
    Last edited by Buzzo; December 2nd, 2009 at 11:46 AM.

  5. #35
    Member lkystrk's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    My two cents. The short heel is not for people that love too gamble, its too slow. I think that a short heel rooster must really be put through a good solid keep, and alot of long heel, short knife and long knife type roosters will fall apart in this type of keep. in my opinion you will seperate alot of the good from the bad in the keep. My grand father was a short heel man and his birds would not go into the brood pen until they had 3 wins under there belt, in the short heel. I think people will be suprised how many fast heel type roosters came out of the slow heel type familys that are so popular today. I also think that there are going to be alot of dissapointed people that will find out there birds are not game enough to go from the long knife to the short heel. and the people that stick with it could very well be the hulseys and hatches of the future.

  6. #36
    Senior Member nonny's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    as promised a pair of 1 1/4" Davis short heels
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #37
    Senior Member nonny's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    a comparison , these were my grandfathers and were used in the early years of 1900 , dont know exactly how old they are but think them english made
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  8. #38
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzo View Post
    Preacher Hatch. Im close friends with the man who started that line of chickens. He still raises them. His brothers are dark/light red, his come lemonhackle all straight comb. They weren't blueface though. Story goes they're a stolen family of brood pen 37 (37 or 17 I cant remember) from Sandy Hatch. If I remember the story correctly someone stole the birds from Duke Husley when he took over Hatch's farm. The took the family of birds and walked them at a preachers farm. The Preacher gave away the stags to Jerry because they were killing each other. Jerry then went back and got the rest of the what he had.
    The two brothers you are talking about are the gary and jerry vicory.

  9. #39
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Its a different mental chicken and different physically built chicken. Most longheel fowl of today would have a hard time competing with boys who do it every weekend. It takes the HANDLER out of the game. I love the whole idea.
    Last edited by MONGOOSE; January 24th, 2012 at 03:52 AM.

  10. #40
    Senior Member BamaOkie's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Postista is the closest modern day contest to shortheel. I think they put time limits on Postista matches though.

  11. #41
    Senior Member gaff's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    1 1/2 inch average fight is ten mins, some one fly some half an hour or more. Power is a great asset but cutting is your best friend. He's only got a little steel, if he can't cut he'll be walloping away and his opponent will still stand.
    The keep for me, same as long heel. I use mike ratcliff keep. If you get it right your bird won't be found wanting. Good long heel birds, as long as they are decent cutters will make good 1 1/2 inch birds. It's long enough for a body cutter and short enough for a head striker.
    In the drag a short heel will end it quicker in most cases than a long heel IMO.
    Last edited by gaff; January 24th, 2012 at 04:45 AM.

  12. #42
    Member NoShowGameFowl's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    No offense to our phillipino brothers but i believe that the knife ruined cockfighting in america

  13. #43
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Gaff would of been on its way out eventually.
    Hell right now there trying to stop hunting, fishing, dog breeding, animal ownership, and lets not forget animal consumption. There "just getting started", mark my words.

  14. #44
    Member joero21's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by NoShowGameFowl View Post
    No offense to our phillipino brothers but i believe that the knife ruined cockfighting in america
    How do you feel about the Mexican short knife? ? .

  15. #45
    Member NoShowGameFowl's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Somewhat in between on the sk. I like it as well. But either way im getting more and more depressed with this country

  16. #46
    Senior Member Roberts44903's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by BamaOkie View Post
    Postista is the closest modern day contest to shortheel. I think they put time limits on Postista matches though.
    LOL bama is all I can say

  17. #47
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Short heels are culling machines lol I love to watch them cocks go at it!

  18. #48
    Senior Member gaff's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    You'll be surprised how quick those fight go. Only to the head so one shot can end it. Some showed cubans in SH they are deadly accurate.

  19. #49
    Senior Member Roberts44903's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by gaff View Post
    You'll be surprised how quick those fight go. Only to the head so one shot can end it. Some showed cubans in SH they are deadly accurate.
    Give me body hitting rooster for them little heels any day of the week. Back when it was legal of course LOL

  20. #50
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Being born and raised in CT. I was brought up in short heels. Still have alot of the bloodlines from there. I would say anyone that thinks long heels are a faster finish are dead wrong. As far as a well conditioned gamecock, I feel you need one in any weapon. Of course as time went on from the 60's to the 70's to the 80's to the 90's to when ever. People got lazy and decided you didnt need a well conditioned cock. That a flypen keep will work or move them alittle. Well they do work but not because they condition a cock but because the folks that still condition a cock are few between,so your going into cocks that dont have good condition so they show well against them. But most short heel folks have great condition. I think any well conditioned cock can compete in short heel. From my past experience the only difference is the length of the heel. I knew folks from up there that would fight short heel there and go down and do very well in the south with long heel. using the same fowl.Its like this if you have good roosters you can tie a 10 penny nail on them with baler twine and there gonna kill them a rooster.

  21. #51
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    The posts by Irishcutt and BlackDeath hit the nail right on the head. Now after reading some of the other posts I can tell some don't have a clue about shortheel fighting. I cannot see how some think a short heel fight is boring. There is little handling and the roosters get to do the work,not the handler. If anything a long heel fight is boring especially when the roosters get tired and you have to handle after every fly.

    Now what some don't know or realize.....there is a difference between using short heel regulation type heels and the old slow heels/peg awls. When using the regulation short heel you must have gameness,cut, conditioning,and power is helpful. When using the slow heels you need gameness,power,and conditioning. Cutting makes little difference when using the "blunts" as the fowl basically just hammer on each other. My Grandfathers had 2 types of slow heels: the Peg Awls which were 1 1/4,came straight out from the socket with no curve or rise and were blunt on the end and....the Intermediate heels: These were 1 1/8", came straight out from the socket with no curve or rise but were sharp on the end. If you really want to test how GAME your fowl are then I suggest tying on a pair of these heels and find out. How many of you would fight a main using them? And a side note on length....in the northeast there are still areas where the 1 1/2" is considered a long heel! I would post a picture of them but my scanner is not working here.

    Mark Marsh

  22. #52
    Senior Member BamaOkie's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by Roberts44903 View Post
    LOL bama is all I can say


    Explain your comment please cause, it piss's me off!

  23. #53
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by blackdeath View Post
    You are mostly accurate in your opion. The 1 1/2 gaff is a beautiful weapon. Is short enough for the rooster to be able to pull on his own. It is long enough to hit any vital. Any good cutting rooster pumping them babies under the wings of the opposing cock is a winner in short order. Down the back too, a quick winner. "Birds can win in one fly or go the distance." That's the best of both worlds my friend. "You will need 3/4 less chickens as well as most winners can be trained again after two weeks..." Yes, you can make 5-6-7 time winners in a single season with them. Their recovery time is very short.

    "The biggest fallacy is that you need game chickens for the 1 inch knfe." Not quite accurate with this statement. Many 1" knife fight are quite grueling affairs. The participants often cut each others legs nearly off in the 1st and 2nd buckle. Then, from there you have two crippled roosters battling it out. And, gameness will come to the fore.

    Sweaters, ask the boys what happens to the Sweaters when those big Sweater breeders drive them to the North a couple of hours and turn them loose. Their boxes are a lot lighter on the way back home. The Sweaters are left in the dead barrel. You guys got lots of them Sweaters in the Islands. If you want them thinned out, start fighting in 1 1/2 gaff. Wont take long....yfis
    I have heard that about them sweaters.What about that pullet in your avatar?Do you have any like that one for sale?

  24. #54
    Member ElMartyr's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by vanjoe View Post
    Does anyone out there know a website or has some video clips to share with us an actual fight using shortgaff....PLS SHARE it will be gratefully appreciated...THANK YOU!!! Were just Curious....
    Go to youtube.com

    And search: "gallos de pelea"

    This means cockfight in spanish, you will be watching mexican cockfighting which only consists of short gaffs


    Better yet, heres a link, enjoy!


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOHJ...e_gdata_player

  25. #55
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Elmartyr, That link would be short knife, not gaff. Mexican cock fighting is short knife predominatly.

  26. #56
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by southernX View Post
    Elmartyr, That link would be short knife, not gaff. Mexican cock fighting is short knife predominatly.
    Oh lol im terribly sorry. Ill admit i didnt kno the difference. My english cockfight vocabulary isnt as extensive as the knowledge i have in spanish. Thank you sir for the corection, i learn somthing everyday

  27. #57
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    What would be better for a rusher? A smarts or a flyer?

  28. #58
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    For those who think long heel fights are quicker than short heels here is a quote from the August 1939 issue of Grit and Steel concerning the "North vs South" main between Marsh and Law which was fought in long heels......"Strange to relate,there were more and longer drags in the long heels (on an average)than in short heels."

    Mark Marsh

  29. #59
    Senior Member Roberts44903's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Bama I didnt mean to make ya mad just sent pm explaining what I ment

  30. #60
    Senior Member BamaOkie's Avatar
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    Re: Shortgaff Cockfighting

    Quote Originally Posted by Roberts44903 View Post
    Bama I didnt mean to make ya mad just sent pm explaining what I ment
    Sorry for my response WE cool! Misunderstanding on my part.

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