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  1. #1
    didier
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    thai gamefowls

    does anyone know who breeds this roosters?here in the philippines?

  2. #2
    Member yajgph's Avatar
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    Talking Re: thai gamefowls

    a lot of it in mindanao, there's a lot of breeders in mindanao for naked heel fighting purpose

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    CyberFriends Draven51501's Avatar
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    there are breeders of thai fowl in the phils.. but depends on what you what type of asil you want, for spur or for boxing..

    Spangle Thai Asil Spurred type:
    pure cock:

    pure hen:


    i only have the hen.

  4. #4
    didier
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    thanks draven,but where did you get your thai hen?was it imported?was planning to cross it with western birds to get there intelligence and cutting ability,maybe just get a quarter of the bloodline,if i were to use asil,it would definitely be thai for it is the smaller asil type,..is it easy to import from thailand?

  5. #5
    rob_roi
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi didier,

    there are breeders of thai among naked heelers in mindanao and also in iloilo. some keep it pure and others crossed it to other orientals.
    THAI is NOT an Asil.
    The smaller types of asil are the reza asils (ex sonatol, ghan) and the bigger types are the kulang asils (Hyberabad, calcutta, madras) these are commonly found in india. other Oriental fowls used for nakedheel are the THAI (ex LHK), PAMA/Burmese,Shamo, Brazilian, Taiwan

  6. #6
    CyberFriends Draven51501's Avatar
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    Wink Re: thai gamefowls

    Quote Originally Posted by didier
    thanks draven,but where did you get your thai hen?was it imported?was planning to cross it with western birds to get there intelligence and cutting ability,maybe just get a quarter of the bloodline,if i were to use asil,it would definitely be thai for it is the smaller asil type,..is it easy to import from thailand?
    didier, there are 2 types of Thai the bigger ones are for Boxing and the smaller ones are for spur fighting. you can fight even at halves if you get the spurred-type

    click HERE

  7. #7
    rob_roi
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi. just for info:

    Thai fighting cock
    The two major thai fighting cock variaties, are namely the leung hang khao (yellow body white tail) and the pradu hang dam (brown body black tail) cocks.
    Thai fighting cocks are well-known throughout the asian region for their beauty and fighting skills. Thai fighting cocks originated in south east asia, developing from the red jungle fowl, which are present in thailand, myanmar, indochina and the philippines. The breed has been maintained by thai breeders who select and develop the breed for cockfighting.
    In the olden days cockfighting was not confined to rural areas. During the ayudhya period (19th century ) prince naresuan, while held hostage by the burmese, brought with him the leung hang khao cock to compete with the burmese prince. Prince naresuan's brother, prince ekathosaros, also enjoyed the sport of cockfighting using the breed pradu hang dam.
    The leung hang khao cock originated in the northern part of thailand ( ban krang village, phitsanulock ), and is spread throughout thailand and south east asia. The standards of perfection for leung hang khao breed is determined and described from prominent traits of the cock, ranging from general physical features, behavioral patterns and fighting styles.
    The leung hang khao breed is a middle size bird averaging 3.00 kg. To 3.5 kg. For a cock and only 3.0 kg. For a female. The cock is covered with black feathers but from the back of the skull to the end of the body, the feathers are yellow-red, which varies according to different varieties. As the name implies, its long tail is white especially on the top part. The female bird is slightly shorter and covered with black feathers dotted with white.
    The pradu hang dam is the ancestor of the japanese "shamo" which was brought into japan at the beginning of the 16th century. In indonesia, thai fighting cocks are so popular that they are known as bangkok ayam.
    The pradu hang dam refers to brown cocks with black tails. It is another genuine thai breed originating from lower central thailand. Both male and female pradu hang dam breeds are slightly bigger then leung hang khao but the physical features generally look almost the same, except for the color. There is also a wide variety of pradu hang dam breeds distributed across the country.
    In thailand today cockfighting is still a popular sport, especially so in the rural areas where cockfighting has always been a part of life. Most village households raise fighting cocks in their backyards for sport and also for their firm and tasty meat.

    you can see pics of these varieties at ganoi.com even from philippine members
    Last edited by rob_roi; June 27th, 2008 at 03:20 PM.

  8. #8
    CyberFriends Draven51501's Avatar
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    Wink Re: thai gamefowls

    Quote Originally Posted by didier
    thanks draven,but where did you get your thai hen?was it imported?was planning to cross it with western birds to get there intelligence and cutting ability,maybe just get a quarter of the bloodline,if i were to use asil,it would definitely be thai for it is the smaller asil type,..is it easy to import from thailand?
    dider,
    the hen is imported from Thailand to Malaysia to Cebu.. it is very troublesome since the ban of chickens from other countries took effect a few years ago.. best way is probably to get it is from Oriental breeders here or get eggs directly from Thailand..


    rob,
    nice info on the description of the Thai fowl and you are right they are not asil as I read at ganoi, I just got used to hearing it from my Malaysian friend..

    i have seen those dark colored Thais with white spots at ganoi.com when i was searching for the same colored feathers as the Thai Spangled Spurred hen that I received from my Malaysian friend which is one of only 2 hens that a big breeder in Thailand allowed him(my friend) to purchase even if he already bought a lot of roosters from the guy.

    i was told that pure orientals are fought either in taped boxing or with spurs and the type of oriental to be fought will depend on what type of fight.. as the Spurred Orientals cannot last long in a taped boxing fight and the bigger orientals cannot endure the pain of the spurs put on. do you guys fight your orientals with spurs or boxing only?

  9. #9
    didier
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi draven,how can i get a hold of your cell?maybe you know some people who can assist me with tthem?if in thailand which farm would you recommend?who are the breeders here in the philippines ,i can get ahold of?

  10. #10
    rob_roi
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi draven,

    boxing without or with natural spurs only. there's a lot of thai breeders around here. i only kept a thai broodhen. in our experience, Thais are very skillful (fighting style wise/locker types) fighters but going through long fights (>1hr), they tend to surrender early (can't take the beatings). that's why we cross it to other orientals.

    my thai broodhen

  11. #11
    nikilorenzo
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    Smile Re: thai gamefowls

    Hello Didier,try Gameboy's Orientals,they're imported and a well known kid in Iloilo in naked heel fight.He got a lot of different breed,from Thai to shamo,etc...cell no. 09192208463......ILOILO NAKED HEELERS.Goodluck.

  12. #12
    CyberFriends Draven51501's Avatar
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    Wink Re: thai gamefowls

    Quote Originally Posted by rob_roi
    ...Thais are very skillful (fighting style wise/locker types) fighters but going through long fights (>1hr), they tend to surrender early (can't take the beatings)..
    rob,
    thank you for answering, maybe what you have is the spurred type of Thai? i was told they cannot take the beating of boxing but can take the cut of the spurs..


    didier,
    take time to select your Thai carefully.. like what my friend told me, there are 2 types, get the spurred type if you intend to cross it to american fowl for the long knife.. my friend paid RM1,500-2k per rooster but the hens was way higher..

    these are the 50/50 sons, i will be fighting quarters in the stag derbies:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBAawLc2Za8&fmt=18

    2x winner at 11 mos. was supposed fight him again last May but he started dropping his feathers:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tP0hPayU_rk&fmt=18
    Last edited by Draven51501; June 28th, 2008 at 08:20 AM.

  13. #13
    onadski
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    sorry guys i didnt notice that this is a
    english discussion

  14. #14
    rob_roi
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi draven,

    most thais here (mine/seen/heard) do not have spurs. i have yet to see spurred pure thais. unless they are crossed to other breed that has spurs.
    in regards to crossing to western birds, i don't have any experience but i believe any pure thai would be great. we cross thais to other orientals because of their fighting style/ability. mostly locker types, they easily dodge incoming kicks/cuts. we try to cross this style to gameness (indian,brazilian,igon).
    aside from thais, i think pama/burmese would be another great breed to cross with western fowls too.

    nikilorenzo,

    i don't think my friend lawrence/gameboy will sell his pure breds. his foundation breed is the jap shamo crossed to cobra. if you'll ask for a thai, you'll moslty get a 1/2 shamo, 1/4 cobra, 1/4 thai

  15. #15
    onadski
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    sir rob your right, i acquire orientals
    to lawrence/gameboy
    its a cross 50-50
    and a 3 way cross

    ill post the pic tomorrow

  16. #16
    rob_roi
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi sir onadski,

    i got a gift from gameboy. that is 1/2 shamo, 1/4 cobra, 1/4 thai (50% LHK) 2 mos old pullet back last September she's laying right now crossed to 1/2thai (PHD)1/2basilan. i don't know how he's doing right now after iloilo sunk from the typhoon. our friends from the sport lost so much aces especially those nakedheelers in jaro.

    didier,

    anyway, there are a lot of breeders of thais in mindanao who do not have access to the internet. mostly these are backyard breeders who have access to the "back door".

    try JDL Jolo Warrior at ganoi.com . he has one of the best collections of thais here in the Philippines

    LEUNG HANG KAO
    http://www.ganoi.com/photopost/showp...&ppuser=105316


    PRADU HANG DAN
    http://www.ganoi.com/photopost/showp...&ppuser=105316

  17. #17
    Senior Member earan's Avatar
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  18. #18
    Member SheltonRH's Avatar
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    Up.................pppppppppppppppppppp........... ......

  19. #19
    onadski
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    good day to all of you
    cockmates, here are the orientals
    i directly acquire to gameboy

    http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/b...i/P4270276.jpg
    http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/b...i/P4270266.jpg
    http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/b...i/P4270261.jpg

    the broodcock is 50%shamo x 50%cobra
    the white hen is 50%thai x 50%cobra
    the dom hen is 50%thai x 25%shamo x 25%cobra

    yes sir rob the typhoon is devastating
    hope gameboy will recover from the damage
    coz his a good man

    by the way the dom hen already
    has 5 chicks now, its all hen hatch

  20. #20
    CyberFriends Draven51501's Avatar
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    Wink Re: thai gamefowls

    rob,
    what type of oriental grow spurs on both male and female and what orientals has this color? my friend got the cock and hen from Thailand, i have this hen. i do not fight nakedheel or spurs.. but my Thai seems to blend very well with american games, i initially crossed it with Murphy tested sons in knife fights and selected 1 son and crossed it to Roundheads.. i just sparred the banded 5 month old stags a few days ago for the first time and seems to be much faster than the 5050s but still has the timing.
    Last edited by Draven51501; June 29th, 2008 at 04:52 PM.

  21. #21
    rob_roi
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi draven,

    most orientals grew spurs on them. but unlike thais (as far as i know) some don't have any at all while others have so short. i've seen 4yr old thais with less than half an inch spurs. shorter than a western battlestags' spurs.
    although, orientals in this part of the region are somewhat a descendant of the thais and only evolve through crosses of other native fowls in the region. i have an indonesian stag that does not have any spurs but fights like a thai though only shorter. there are malaysian and indonesian orientals that are also fought in naked heels. most of them have spurs. closest to thai are the burmese/pama another fowl used for boxing. they too have spurs. in luzon, bicol/igon, also fought in naked heel, are also a descendant of the thai. only crossed to the shorter native fowl of bicol.
    old folks here describe thais as dark colored (black,red), about 3.0-3.8kgs, about as tall as shamos and do not have spurs. anyway, i only seen what we have and considered here as thais. they may have been other varieties that i do not know of

  22. #22
    onadski
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    Quote Originally Posted by rob_roi
    hi draven,
    Quote Originally Posted by rob_roi

    most orientals grew spurs on them. but unlike thais (as far as i know) some don't have any at all while others have so short. i've seen 4yr old thais with less than half an inch spurs. shorter than a western battlestags' spurs.
    although, orientals in this part of the region are somewhat a descendant of the thais and only evolve through crosses of other native fowls in the region. i have an indonesian stag that does not have any spurs but fights like a thai though only shorter. there are malaysian and indonesian orientals that are also fought in naked heels. most of them have spurs. closest to thai are the burmese/pama another fowl used for boxing. they too have spurs. in luzon, bicol/igon, also fought in naked heel, are also a descendant of the thai. only crossed to the shorter native fowl of bicol.
    old folks here describe thais as dark colored (black,red), about 3.0-3.8kgs, about as tall as shamos and do not have spurs. anyway, i only seen what we have and considered here as thais. they may have been other varieties that i do not know of
    sir rob have you try crossing
    gameboy's orientals to western fowl

    if so hows the result is it good?
    is it crossable to western fowl

  23. #23
    Senior Member Dynamite asil's Avatar
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    Very good info Guys

  24. #24
    CyberFriends Draven51501's Avatar
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    Wink Re: thai gamefowls

    Quote Originally Posted by rob_roi
    .. only seen what we have and considered here as thais. they may have been other varieties that i do not know of
    hello rob, i called my friend after reading your post, he said that Thais with black or blue plumage are the bigger variety and they are good for naked heel fights.. while for spurred fights, they use smaller Thais with spurs mostly with spangle plumage.

  25. #25
    rob_roi
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi draven.

    i see. thanks for the info.
    thais in literature are more on the naked heel side. so i'm not really familiar with the spurred type. btw, is this artifical spurs?
    anyway, about your question with the origin of a spurred thai, one member of ganoi.com who is from thailand once complained that why is it that fowls coming from thailand are all called thais and not by their variety, ex. the Leung Hang Kao or the Pradu Hang Dan, because to them it is distinctively different. Maybe there lies our answer to the thais with spurs and to thais without spurs. any fowl coming from one country is generally called as such (thais,malaysian,indonesian,indian,pakistani, even philippine asils etc). maybe because we're not sure what variety it is and that varieties may have evolved and also it's embarrasing to name it without knowing the history of the fowl. all we know is that its from thailand. same goes with indian and pakistani.

    hi sir onadski,

    i haven't tried grading the thai cross from gameboy. but i tried her in naked heel (hen boxing) for an hour against the groups gamest hen and she's very game and intelligent (locks, plucks and spin). no sweat dodging kicks. so i guess they can produce quality grades.
    anyway, about grading, i think thais are more qualified than any other orientals. just my view though. in choosing which one to grade, power, game, style. i think style should dominate in grading since it's just a couple of seconds before the fight ends in knife. unlike boxing that gameness comes first then power then style. so i guess gameboy's thais are okay if you grade them
    Last edited by rob_roi; June 30th, 2008 at 08:48 PM.

  26. #26
    onadski
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    Re: thai gamefowls

    Quote Originally Posted by rob_roi
    hi draven.

    i see. thanks for the info.
    thais in literature are more on the naked heel side. so i'm not really familiar with the spurred type. btw, is this artifical spurs?
    anyway, about your question with the origin of a spurred thai, one member of ganoi.com who is from thailand once complained that why is it that fowls coming from thailand are all called thais and not by their variety, ex. the Leung Hang Kao or the Pradu Hang Dan, because to them it is distinctively different. Maybe there lies our answer to the thais with spurs and to thais without spurs. any fowl coming from one country is generally called as such (thais,malaysian,indonesian,indian,pakistani, even philippine asils etc). maybe because we're not sure what variety it is and that varieties may have evolved and also it's embarrasing to name it without knowing the history of the fowl. all we know is that its from thailand. same goes with indian and pakistani.

    hi sir onadski,

    i haven't tried grading the thai cross from gameboy. but i tried her in naked heel (hen boxing) for an hour against the groups gamest hen and she's very game and intelligent (locks, plucks and spin). no sweat dodging kicks. so i guess they can produce quality grades.
    anyway, about grading, i think thais are more qualified than any other orientals. just my view though. in choosing which one to grade, power, game, style. i think style should dominate in grading since it's just a couple of seconds before the fight ends in knife. unlike boxing that gameness comes first then power then style. so i guess gameboy's thais are okay if you grade them
    thanks for the info sir rob
    im planning to experiment on gameboys oriental
    ill try to put western blood on them
    and see the result, i hope this will be good
    anyway sir were is your location?
    is there any nakedheelers here in luzon?
    im from bulacan

  27. #27
    CyberFriends Draven51501's Avatar
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    Wink Re: thai gamefowls

    Quote Originally Posted by rob_roi
    hi draven.

    i see. thanks for the info.
    thais in literature are more on the naked heel side. so i'm not really familiar with the spurred type. btw, is this artifical spurs?
    anyway, about your question with the origin of a spurred thai, one member of ganoi.com who is from thailand once complained that why is it that fowls coming from thailand are all called thais and not by their variety, ex. the Leung Hang Kao or the Pradu Hang Dan, because to them it is distinctively different. Maybe there lies our answer to the thais with spurs and to thais without spurs. any fowl coming from one country is generally called as such (thais,malaysian,indonesian,indian,pakistani, even philippine asils etc). maybe because we're not sure what variety it is and that varieties may have evolved and also it's embarrasing to name it without knowing the history of the fowl. all we know is that its from thailand. same goes with indian and pakistani.
    hello rob,
    that maybe the reason, generalizing breed by country when if fact there are several sub-family or variety.. in my search at ganoi, i have only seen 2 or 3 photos with the same plumage and stance as the Spangled Thai that I have.. I would have wanted to learn the variety but they speak a different langauge..

    my friend specified them to me as spur type or non-spur type, and since they come from Thailand, I call them Spangled Thai Spurred type in most of my post..

    my friend fights in both natural spur and artificial spur.. "if the alignment is correct, it will kill like the long knife"..

    hope you will continue posting about the Thais.. i sparred the 3 Thais 5 month olds again this morning, the opponents are Lemon/Roundheads, will be thrown back every time they meet in the air.. should tell me something about their reach and power.. hope their accuracy is there also.. i just remembered something, i will not spar the Thais against americans anymore, last year, i lost a good Brassback Roundhead from sparring with 1 of the initial cross.. got hit at the base of the neck, seemed fine when he is walking but when you spar him, the brassback will make a nosedive to the ground.. even after several months, he never recovered.. so had to cull that bird..

    hope you can also post some of your fights at youtube.. the oriental fights i've seen are taken by a very blurry cam or hands..

  28. #28
    onadski
    Guest

    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi sir rob
    i just talked to gameboy this afternoon
    asking him if they have success in
    crossing his oriental to western fowl
    and he said just grade his oriental to a hatch fowl
    to 1/4 blood and it is good
    they try it with 1/4oriental x 1/4 lemon x 1/2 hatch
    and it is winning

  29. #29
    rob_roi
    Guest

    Re: thai gamefowls

    hi draven,

    that's true. i have seen thais from other breeders and i am hoping to get more infos on the difference of what i have and what my opponents have. but it's really hard. there are thai websites but they're not in english. there are other breeders in some forums but closest we'll get are from malaysia and breeders from the states (in US, i think are already crosses). the most that we can get from the net are the english threads which are mostly confined to two varieties. if you check out thai site you'll see fowls that are somewhat distant to the features of the two variety but it's not in english. hope we'll meet someone soon who is a respectable breeder of thais in thailand to enlighten us more.

    about the fighting characteristic, in boxing, thais are locker types. means they are comfortable fighting close (like dragging each other shoulder to shoulder). they're not free kicker types (like the pama) that's why they seldom strike but with good precision.

    an old friend of mine once told me about these characteristic of the thai. the locker types are breeds who are afraid to get hit. means they lock their opponent so as to control the striking ability of the opponent by dragging them and pushing them out. when the opponent tries to strike, it can't strike the body since it'll be too close and he'll be outbalanced each time providing the opportunity for the locker to strike (mostly to the head when the other falls after it strike). after each strike, they'll be in distance again so the locker will try to dodge every kicks of the opponent (won't do a pound for pound) until it comes close to lock the opponent again. this trait will hold when the opponent is as high or is smaller than the thai. when faced with bigger opponents, as afraid as he is against an opponent's strike, he'll dodge and dodge and will only strike once when he'll see a good opportunity. they will seldom strike but with good precision. this is why thais are good defensive fighters.
    the structure of orientals are way to heavier than a western fowl. if some orientals can break bones against another oriental, then it would be easier for them to break that of a westerns'. the slower they strike, the harder it gets.

    hi sir onadski,

    how is lawrence? how's his fowls?
    our friend in jaro lost about a hundred fowls from the typhoon. too bad they only flew 3 broodmaterials to us leaving other pure lines behind. my friend was devastated.
    anyway, i tried crossing gameboy's thai to a white claret. i don't know what will be the outcome of this all power
    slow + slow hehe

  30. #30
    onadski
    Guest

    Re: thai gamefowls

    sir rob gameboy said he's ok
    although he lost some of his orientals
    but he's ok
    hope u produce good one sir
    do u use pure thai or cross
    the bird i got from gameboy is crosses

    broodcock is half shamo x half cobra
    and it spar really good with my texas bird
    i use him as sparring partner
    if i want a big sparring partner

    the white hen i got is half thai x half cobra

    and yhe dom hen is 1/4shamo x 1/4cobra x halfthai

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