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Thread: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

  
  1. #1
    Moderator cnucum's Avatar
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    Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Hi guys,

    Just need some info on these very very fine fowl... Have read about them and seen em on photo's...

    Wonder if anyone here keeps the real deal "steel game" ones, been pondering of getting some if they are within reach to do some breeding and experiments...

    Thanks,

    Chris
    Aseel d Past, Present & Future - M.Romulo

  2. #2
    Moderator cnucum's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    I got these photo's from ganoi.com... So for the owner's I appologize for borrowing your fowls photo...











    Again "these are not mine" just so some of you guys that are not familiar with them can see...

    Chris
    Aseel d Past, Present & Future - M.Romulo

  3. #3
    Senior Member newtogame2's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    i would call them steel fowls, not necessarily steel game fowls

    i'm estimating about 20%-30% would run or sulk... good cutters though... like many asil strains, or even american strains, it depends on what you get...

    the infusion of american blood in recent years have improved both speed and gameness.



    (ga cua = spurred fowls


    ga don = naked/taped fowls

    ga noi = pure of a high class, similar to the word asil, although many people use this term for ga don, as that was the only game in town up to 30 - 40 years ago, when people in VN started messing around with steel... probably brought on by american soldiers...

    first it was the bantams that was used, not much gameness there... then they were crossed to ga don for more size and game, still not good enough... then they started looking a lot like sumatras but with many colors instead of black, so my guess is someones started crossing sumatras to ga don (except for the first pic posted by cnucum, the other 4 look like sumatra in my opinion)... now with american blood, some will have tails pointing up... there were also stories about general Cao Ky being gifted a good american rooster from someone in the PI, then one of his helpers stole the eggs and gave them to their relatives in Ben Tre, thus giving that province a leg up on everyone else on the breeding of ga cua. to this day, that province is still known for having the best ga cua... )
    Last edited by newtogame2; April 27th, 2009 at 10:25 PM.

  4. #4
    Jonjon
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    If you scroll down on page 2 you will see we hade some of this conversation last week labeled vietnam pits. Ive been there many times and I know that American game fowl is far more superior. But You can do any experiment you want. I dont know the out come and I do not know how to find these birds here in the staes. But If you tryed to bring them here from Vietnam you might have problems because of the bird flu issue. But I do believe that they are crossed with Sumatra and I do Have some sumatras . If you are interested in doing that ..I hoped I helped you.

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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Jonjon:I see you are here in the US. Which part? I am in the L.A. County area. So you also have the Sumatras, too?? My experimentations with the Sumatra crossed on to the American bird has yielded nothing but pesky manfighters regardless of whether I used the Sumatra cock or the hen. The hen was wild and quite an instigator. When she sounds off, everyone else joins in cacophony and I was afraid the neighbors would have me reported for noise nuisance. It quieted down remarkably after she was culled. I may sound like I am disappointed with this hobby and experimentation, dabbling with the non-game stuff but I am not. What is frustrating though are the harsh and stupid laws they have on ownership of game fowl propelled by the ARAT's especially if you happen to live within city limits.

    So what's been your experience like with your Sumatras? Anything good and promising?


    Newtogame2: I think you are correct in your observation about the Sumatra blood infusion on these Ga cuas which may make them not steel game. Again, I also agree with what you said that there are sulkers and quitters regardless of whether the breed is American or Oriental since gameness is relative. Not to forget even the table top chickens have their own share of bravado. (LOL!!!)


    Chris: I have met a man who's from Vietnam late last year and I don't really know much about him except that he owns some Ga cuas. He was quite nice and he showed me how different the Vietnamese Asils are from the ones that I pointed at that were short and squatty in appearance. He told me of the balance of 3rd's when it comes to Ga cuas. The head and neck comprise a 3rd, the body another 3rd and last 3rd would be the tail. I see his point which makes them beautiful along with their excellent station.

    He is based here in California but currently in Vietnam and while he is gone a friend of his is looking after the birds. It was kind of awkward asking a person you just met if he sells his chickens but I managed to say I could wait until such time he has some to part with, and he told me he would give me a pullet as a gift instead, hopefully sometime this summer. I guess I'm thrilled with his offer especially after he told me he fights them in gaffs.

    I do get a lot of criticisms though, from friends who tell me what a waste of time it is dabbling with these breeds but I guess everyone is different. If I hear anything, I sure will give you a holler.
    Last edited by rk_opteryx; April 28th, 2009 at 08:08 AM.

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    Moderator cnucum's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Thanks for all the tips and info guys, I appreciate them... I am just fascinated with these fowls... Their looks, build and the stuff I read about em... Ofcourse you hear issue's of gameness problems but that goes as well to almost all game fowls also...

    Just an interest, but not something I would "die" for to get one... If there are any around locally, good, if there aren't any then it's also ok... Everyone knows that true "pit" fowls are bred to the standard based on how people fight them... Every breed is for a specific task as they say... I believe that the Ga Cua are the closer to the "Filipino Style" where in one would sacrifice a bit of gameness for more speed and better cutting which is the trade mark for LK fights, the funny thing is, the Ga Cua are fought in Long Gaff (see first photo)...

    Hope to hear more comments info on these very fine "pit" fowls...

    Thanks,

    Chris
    Aseel d Past, Present & Future - M.Romulo

  7. #7
    Senior Member newtogame2's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Quote Originally Posted by rk_opteryx


    Newtogame2: I think you are correct in your observation about the Sumatra blood infusion on these Ga cuas which may make them not steel game. Again, I also agree with what you said that there are sulkers and quitters regardless of whether the breed is American or Oriental since gameness is relative. Not to forget even the table top chickens have their own share of bravado. (LOL!!!)
    i think ga don blood is what makes them not steel game. these guys can beat each other up all day and fight with broken wings, beaks... but they cannot take the shock of steel... not saying all ga don are like that, but a lot of them are... it depends on the bloodlines...

    sumatras were used in steel in the usa for a short while with sucess (50 - 100 years ago? i need to check back with History of Gamefowls by Johnson). they were steelgame, fast and had plenty of cut... nobody knows why they were discontinued, but many american blacks today are believed to have sumatra blood in them with their dark skin and fast speed...

  8. #8
    Senior Member newtogame2's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Quote Originally Posted by cnucum
    Thanks for all the tips and info guys, I appreciate them... I am just fascinated with these fowls... Their looks, build and the stuff I read about em... Ofcourse you hear issue's of gameness problems but that goes as well to almost all game fowls also...

    Just an interest, but not something I would "die" for to get one... If there are any around locally, good, if there aren't any then it's also ok... Everyone knows that true "pit" fowls are bred to the standard based on how people fight them... Every breed is for a specific task as they say... I believe that the Ga Cua are the closer to the "Filipino Style" where in one would sacrifice a bit of gameness for more speed and better cutting which is the trade mark for LK fights, the funny thing is, the Ga Cua are fought in Long Gaff (see first photo)...

    Hope to hear more comments info on these very fine "pit" fowls...

    Thanks,

    Chris
    my brother back there told me in the 90s the LK was introduced, but didn't last long... too much damage to the winners for them to be shown again... you have to figure in the economic factor too. most people there cannot afford many fowls... culling is something most never heard of let alone practice, and that may be another factor why there are many runners/sulkers... what you put in your pocket is a lot more important than gameness, so ABILITY is #1. some cocks won a lot of money for their owners, then lost one but didn't die, were nurtured back to health and earned their owners more money...

    the name of the game is different... some owners will purposely send their bad roosters, bet a large amount on them to get others to "bite", then have their friends/relatives bet on the other side for even more money!!! for example...
    Last edited by newtogame2; April 29th, 2009 at 12:04 AM.

  9. #9
    Jonjon
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    I do have sumatras and they do stand up to any of my other birds. They are fast.I dont think they compare to todays game but that only my opinion. I have been to Vietnam and seen the gaff fights in progress but i still wouldnt bet agains the american game if I saw it there..

  10. #10
    Moderator cnucum's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonjon
    I do have sumatras and they do stand up to any of my other birds. They are fast.I dont think they compare to todays game but that only my opinion. I have been to Vietnam and seen the gaff fights in progress but i still wouldnt bet agains the american game if I saw it there..
    Yes, the ga cua's will not match up well with american games in gaff or even knife match for that matter but there should be something good in them... Besides their a very nice looking breed of pit fowls (for me anyway), it seems that they have almost every type of pit fowl blood in them, from asil, malay, western, sumatra's which make them all more interesting breed... Much like the Cubalaya's where they are noted to have Philippine Game Fowl origins...

    Chris
    Aseel d Past, Present & Future - M.Romulo

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    Cyberfriends CALVIN2's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Good thread guys , I missed it I guess ..OR I would not have started " Black Sumatras"
    LOL this one turned much better ..
    THANKS

  12. #12
    CyberFriends Paz Brey's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    very,very nice fowls! i wish i could have one!

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    Cyberfriends CALVIN2's Avatar
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    Re: Ga Cua - Vietnamese Steel Game Fowl...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonjon
    I do have sumatras and they do stand up to any of my other birds. They are fast.I dont think they compare to todays game but that only my opinion. I have been to Vietnam and seen the gaff fights in progress but i still wouldnt bet agains the american game if I saw it there..

    hi jonjon,

    can you pm me where do they fight here in Vietnam? there is always an occasion when they fight these, when is this?

    thanks

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