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Thread: Boles asil

  
  1. #661
    Member runner's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    The asils from jumper were 3/4 atkins 1/4 boles. They come from Les to Mac to Jumper.

  2. #662
    Senior Member colt39's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    There are a few Boles out there but no one wants to believe it because the ones they have are not authentic lol.

  3. #663
    Senior Member blades61's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    colt theres a guy on oakridgr that says he fed for boles 20 year ago he has a pair on there now they look real good mine look just like his but looks can be deceiving.

  4. #664
    Senior Member colt39's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    Quote Originally Posted by blades61 View Post
    colt theres a guy on oakridgr that says he fed for boles 20 year ago he has a pair on there now they look real good mine look just like his but looks can be deceiving.
    Yup, I agree. Also, we don't even know if what he say's is true about feeding for Boles. Also, even if he did, chances are, Boles did not give him any thing! But, the problem is, we weren't there to know for a fact!

    Just looked at them. The hen somewhat looks like them but the cock looks very little like a boles cock.

    http://www.oakridgegamefarm.net/auct...c_search=boles
    Last edited by colt39; August 28th, 2011 at 05:03 AM.

  5. #665
    Senior Member colt39's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    This is what Boles Asils look like!






    Found this one on the net!
    Last edited by colt39; August 28th, 2011 at 05:22 AM.

  6. #666
    Senior Member colt39's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil



    Last edited by colt39; August 28th, 2011 at 05:42 AM.

  7. #667
    Senior Member Butch93's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    Jim its not because i dont think my are not authentic cause mine are not boles mine are hamlin. I just live an hour south of madera and know alot of old cockers here who knew boles. Some liked him and other say he was the biggest prick you ever met but they all say the same thing that bobby didnt give out or sell chickens and it didnt matter who you were. Trust me im not bashing your asils i know you have very good ones and thats all that matters. I could care less about the name tagged to them. Jerry is one i know who says his dad was gifted a 1/2 and 1/2 cock from bobby. I know another man who claims to have his black japs and i have a pair right now, had more until my barn fire but that life. The japs are very good but from what i heard i have my doubts they were boles but they are competative and thats all i care about. I know tyere is a million stories on how bobbies blood got out but who knows. If you have a story on how melville obtained his blood id love to hear the story could be a fun topic and please understand im not trying to put the down your fowl they have done proven themselves.
    Yfis
    Mark

  8. #668
    Senior Member colt39's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    Quote Originally Posted by Butch93 View Post
    Jim its not because i dont think my are not authentic cause mine are not boles mine are hamlin. I just live an hour south of madera and know alot of old cockers here who knew boles. Some liked him and other say he was the biggest prick you ever met but they all say the same thing that bobby didnt give out or sell chickens and it didnt matter who you were. Trust me im not bashing your asils i know you have very good ones and thats all that matters. I could care less about the name tagged to them. Jerry is one i know who says his dad was gifted a 1/2 and 1/2 cock from bobby. I know another man who claims to have his black japs and i have a pair right now, had more until my barn fire but that life. The japs are very good but from what i heard i have my doubts they were boles but they are competative and thats all i care about. I know tyere is a million stories on how bobbies blood got out but who knows. If you have a story on how melville obtained his blood id love to hear the story could be a fun topic and please understand im not trying to put the down your fowl they have done proven themselves.
    Yfis
    Mark
    Mark, My Japs are what gets it done for me & they are not Boles, they are mine. I have a few Asils from Les but he is the man who has them. He & Bobby were best friends for a long time until they had a falling out.

    The falling out is none of my business but some say that it was because Les let some of them out. Like you said, some say Bobby was a prick. But, he would not have turned his best friend who he was the Best Man at his wedding away if Les did not have the real stuff to let out to begin with to cost a long friendship.

    I know Les has them because I have seen hundreds of pictures at Les's house from Bobby's farm. I also see what Les has today & they look & have all the characteristic's just like the ones in the pics.

    But, I really don't care what people think of his fowl & neither does he. I call them Melvill's any ways & like you said, if they can get'er done, who cares what name is on them.

    Also, Jerry Hamlin lived close to Les for a time & went to Les to get fowl back then.

    Good chatting with you!
    Last edited by colt39; August 28th, 2011 at 06:03 AM.

  9. #669
    Senior Member Butch93's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    Thanks Jim i hope i didnt offened you because that wasnt my intentions. I appriciate u sharing what you know about them. Yes jerry did get fowl from Les as was as Martin ytuate, travis clark and a few others over the years. He loves raising oriental fowl and has several lines these days. I asked him if he ever added any of the blood to his sonital family and he told me no though. He said the only blood ever added was by his dad and was the 1/2 asil 1/2 jap and that was many years ago. I know he does like crossing his lines and making brood cocks out of the crosses for making his grades. Dont know why but its his thing. Thanks again for sharing i always like learning new history.
    Yfis
    Mark

  10. #670
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    Re: Boles asil

    Quote Originally Posted by Butch93 View Post
    Personaly i dont think anyone has the authintic Bobby boles blood. Not to say that anyone that has the boles name tagged on them doesnt have good ones, i just think anyone that has boles i doublt they were his blood. Someone along the line had some good sonitol asil and tagged the boles name on them so they could make more money. I live not to far from where he is from and there are a million rumors out there on how his blood was gotten. Ive heard they were stolen which i doubt because he kept them locked up tight. When boles was done with his fighting days and close to the end he ordered his feeder idk his name just know he was a mexican guy to go kill every feather on the yard. There are rumors this man smuggled a few out but who really knows. Then there are the chosen few close personal friends who he giftes fowl to. He never gifted pure fowl most were 1/2 asil and 1/2 his black jap and almost all his asil blood had the jap in it so these fowl would be even more than 1/2 jap and thats a fact. Who all he gave these roosters two im not sure i only know one of them. So the chances someone actually has blood that came from boles is slim and none. Now is there people out there that carry this boles blood? Yes anyone who was gifted them could still have them and have bred to the 1/2 1/2 rooster and have close to pure boles blood but it would only be 1/2 asil. Now if the feeder actually smuggled some out and someone could show how the birds have been passed on id beleieve it but i havent seen one yet. Now im not saying some people who have asil that they call boles are not good because i know a few that do i just dont feel they were actually boles.
    Yfis
    Mark
    butch 93 i agree with you,lots of people came out of the woodwork after boles died with pure asils,not when he was alive to dispute it. i know the boles blood i have has got jap blood in it.and i also know several people who new boles gave al cabral a grade cock and jack cabral a hen and told them she was asil .he never told them how the cock or hen was bred,only bobby knows. the ones i own were line bred back to the original asil hen from bobby for many years. i have two lines of asils that were made from boles blood lines,even tho they look pure i know for a fact they are not pure asil,but as close as you can get from starting with and asil jap cross cock and line breedind to asil hen.they are as good as any i have seen when used to make show cocks.i was not around boles all the time to say who got what of his bloodlines,so i agree if it works for somebody to call what they have pure boles asils then go for it.there is no real way to prove or disprove their claims.
    Last edited by scott; August 28th, 2011 at 07:39 AM.

  11. #671
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    Re: Boles asil

    jim i have a picture that was taken on bobby's yard in 1970. it is the asil jap grade cock that bobby gave al cabral ,he is taller and has more tail.nobody knows exactly the way he was bred.i am just guessing from my experience from breeding asil and jap crosses. i enjoyed your photos.

    i got to get a scanner,so i can put up some photos from the old days.

  12. #672
    Senior Member blades61's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    colt those are some mean lookin dudes nice pictures all i have is a hen she looks like the hen on oakridge you are right the cock is different.thank you for your help. i went back and looked again the cock looks like a grade.
    Last edited by blades61; August 28th, 2011 at 08:06 AM.

  13. #673
    Senior Member colt39's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    All of them but two are Bobby's Asils on Bobby's farm when bobby was still alive. So, if you want to know what they look like, there they are on the farm of the man him self.

    The two on the bottom are mine & one I gave Chris in PI.

    Scott, I had a Boles cock that had the jap blood in him. Or may of had the Black Asil Les brought back with him. They are taller & a little slenderer. Mine was bred down though towards the Red. I gave him back to Les but got about 8 pure stags & they are very good Asils. they can really move. they are three year olds now.

    Kept 3 & gave the rest to Les.

    blades61, The cock looks like an Asil but just not the Red Boles. Looks like some Sonatols I have seen or even looks like an Atkinson a bit the way he stands up & the back is heart shaped. The Boles are squar backed & a bit shorter stationed. The Boles head is very big with a big full neck but shorter. The Boles wings point downward. The wing buts as well. Atkinson's wings point outward more so & the wing buts as well.

    Mark, no offence was taken what so ever. We all have a right to our own opinion.
    Last edited by colt39; August 28th, 2011 at 08:37 AM.

  14. #674
    Senior Member newtogame2's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    Jim, notice how in the first 4 pics of the real Boles there were no wattles, but the last 2 pics (i'm guessing Melvill's) the wattles are visibly there... not saying they ain't good, but wattles is a sign of straightcomb blood infusion somewhere along the line.

  15. #675
    Senior Member blades61's Avatar
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    Re: Boles asil

    thank you jim i like the hen i have she looks like you described she is a real skiddish acting hen i am gonna breed her to a ruble cock and see what happens only time will tell.i ask you a couple months ago about a hen you priced me a stag rh/grade did your price include shipping?

  16. #676
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    Re: Boles asil

    Quote Originally Posted by colt39 View Post
    All of them but two are Bobby's Asils on Bobby's farm when bobby was still alive. So, if you want to know what they look like, there they are on the farm of the man him self.

    The two on the bottom are mine & one I gave Chris in PI.

    Scott, I had a Boles cock that had the jap blood in him. Or may of had the Black Asil Les brought back with him. They are taller & a little slenderer. Mine was bred down though towards the Red. I gave him back to Les but got about 8 pure stags & they are very good Asils. they can really move. they are three year olds now.

    Kept 3 & gave the rest to Les.

    blades61, The cock looks like an Asil but just not the Red Boles. Looks like some Sonatols I have seen or even looks like an Atkinson a bit the way he stands up & the back is heart shaped. The Boles are squar backed & a bit shorter stationed. The Boles head is very big with a big full neck but shorter. The Boles wings point downward. The wing buts as well. Atkinson's wings point outward more so & the wing buts as well.

    Mark, no offence was taken what so ever. We all have a right to our own opinion.
    jim mine will come taller 95%% of the time too,but i still get the shorter bulldog type also,i prefer the jap looking ones to make the grades with.i maintain 2 lines of these families one the shorter build the other is the taller jappy body type and add blood from each side of the family into each line as i think they need it.jim as you already know the pure asils are good for only 2 things, that is to make 1/2 breeds to use to make 1/4 breeds and pure asils.the crosses are what i use to build show cocks. it's that damn good cross you are looking for when using oriental fowl to make show cocks.i breed to make better show cocks. i don't breed to keep mine looking like someone thinks they should look so i can say i got pure this and pure that bloodlines.i will use the taller jap asil cross looking cocks more than the little short ones when making show cocks,but it depends on the american family i am using and the body type and station of the american family when using the jap asils to get the body type i prefer, according to the type of show i am planning on using them in. i have some that look as pure to bobby's asils as anyone.when looking at them nobody could say for sure they are not,but i know they are not. no body knew for sure how bobby bred them and it don't matter i know where they came from and how they got started and what they can do when crossed on the right american family. i dont care what mine are called just as long as they can help me build show cocks that is what matters in this sport.

    jim i got about 26 asil stags from this jap asil family this yr. and pullets.
    yes you are right they can move.
    my melville adkinson family is like you are talking about more narrow body and more up-right in stance and a little faster or lighter on there feet.when my adkinson's are crossed to my radio's they can really put on a show.

  17. #677
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    Re: Boles asil

    jim i also cross the boles line that is heavily line bred to my adkinson family that is heavily line bred.this is another line i maintain to use in making show cocks. they are one of my favorites. i cull and select very close to maintain these for body type.
    i have some pretty good japs also,man can they throw them feet.
    hope you the best with yours. yfis

  18. #678
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    Re: Boles asil

    Jim, Is your jap got some BB's black blood in them? or your blacks or maybe both. very innocent question from a neophyte (:
    Last edited by bongped; September 4th, 2011 at 04:53 PM.

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    Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    I now Consider it a honor to Have watched the Boles brothers
    show their birds.
    Being not from that part of the country I did recognize or know
    whom they were..but afterwards I got a crash course
    in all the boles history from my good friend who was an admirer of
    them and their fine fowl.
    I believe I was informed that they bred a Warhorse cock over
    aseel hens.
    Don't know for sure about the breeding..But I know for certain what
    I witnessed they were the best cutters I Have ever seen to this day.
    Maybe some others on here can share their expeirences with the brothers
    and their breed of feathered warriors in their Heyday.

  20. #680
    Member Goldenbirchens's Avatar
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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    Did you see them get beat by Wasatch fowl?

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    Talking Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    Quote Originally Posted by meatpacker666 View Post
    I believe I was informed that they bred a Warhorse cock over
    aseel hens.

    This alone has my interest. I will be glued to this thread.

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    Wink Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenbirchens View Post
    Did you see them get beat by Wasatch fowl?
    No sir but please share your experience if you like.
    another person told me the best cross was between a Jap cock on his BB hens. 44 wins and 0 losses. pretty good in my book.

  23. #683
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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    I do not personally have the experience. I started another thread to see if anyone knew anything about Wasatch. Someone replied they were the only fowl that was able to beat the Boles when they were winning everything. I was just wondering since you saw them if you might be familiar with the Wasatch.???

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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenbirchens View Post
    I do not personally have the experience. I started another thread to see if anyone knew anything about Wasatch. Someone replied they were the only fowl that was able to beat the Boles when they were winning everything. I was just wondering since you saw them if you might be familiar with the Wasatch.???
    sorry Never heard of the Wasatch.
    as I said im not from that part of the country and
    I only witnessed that one show which the Boles oriental crosses dominated
    at that certain meet..everything they met that day got carried out by the
    tail feathers.

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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    the boles chickens have been debated on everything from color to the different families used and what % of blood from each family and who has the real deal.but no one knows what boles breed or crossed or who he gave fowl to and who he did not. he gave out some grades or crosses to a few very close friends and a hen or two also but people that got them were not sure how they were breed. everybody wants to get on the band wagon now since asils seem to be getting more popular these days. if the asil blood you use can win a high percentage for you when crossed on american fowl then use it and call it what ever you want to,names and the word pure don't win chit anyway.the people who know how to bred asils or orientals know that the bloodlines that work to make the best crosses or grades as some call them are what you want to work with anyway. it's just amazing how many people step forward now with pure boles asils. then they can not prove chit ,just repeating what somebody else said that can not prove who has what from boles either. but a person has the right to believe what ever he wants too. lol

    i have heard people say the little black asils were the best and some say the little duck leg short ones are the best and some say the red ones were. bla bla bla

    heal that short leg pure sucker up in the steel and fight him into a good medium high station asil /american cross bred cock or trow a little jap in the mix and see what you think about pure then.

    i am not trying to start something with this post . i am just giving my opinion on asils and crosses.i been working with them a very long time.

    and i still learn about them all the time.

    it is also amazing at the number of people who get on here and have only worked with asils or oriental fowl one or two maybe three yrs. and they are already experts on breeding and training and fighting them and who has the real stuff. lol

    i think mine are good as anybody has because they suit me just find and i don't need all the bullchit stories behind them to make them produce winners. mine were crosses when they were got from boles and no matter how many damn yrs i breed them or line breed them they will never be pure.but i got 4 different lines going off the original stock that looks as pure as any boles asil from anybody because they were selected by body types and breed that way to maintain the traits i wanted in order to get the type of crosses i wanted from them. then i have lines that look more to the asil jap side.then i have the adkinson/ boles line cross asils. i ask anybody to prove me wrong on my asil lines .

    there are a few very good bloodlines out there if you search for them,and leave all the pure bullchit out of it. just my opinion

    you can call mine anything you want to just as long as they call them winners. yfis

  26. #686
    Senior Member Dark Rooster's Avatar
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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    Couldn't agree more Scott! As long as the W's are there u can call em Rhode Island Reds! Lmao!

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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    [QUOTE=scott;3831683]the boles chickens have been debated on everything from color to the different families used and what % of blood from each family and who has the real deal.but no one knows what boles breed or crossed or who he gave fowl to and who he did not. he gave out some grades or crosses to a few very close friends and a hen or two also but people that got them were not sure how they were breed. everybody wants to get on the band wagon now since asils seem to be getting more popular these days. if the asil blood you use can win a high percentage for you when crossed on american fowl then use it and call it what ever you want to,names and the word pure don't win chit anyway.the people who know how to bred asils or orientals know that the bloodlines that work to make the best crosses or grades as some call them are what you want to work with anyway. it's just amazing how many people step forward now with pure boles asils. then they can not prove chit ,just repeating what somebody else said that can not prove who has what from boles either. but a person has the right to believe what ever he wants too. lol............

    Hey scott,

    I'm just wondering if you would agree with this weird thought I have. Somebody who had been breeding asil grades for a very long time would not care anymore about pure asils. What do you think?

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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    Filamex the only thing a pure asil is good for is to make more pure asils to make 1/2 breeds or 1/4 breeds to make battle cocks.
    i don't care if they are 100% pure asil. i want a bloodline that makes the best crosses,so what if it has american,jap or any other blood bred into them in their make-up,as long as they produce winners.that is what cock fighting is all about is producing [winning] fowl in the pit. unless you are a poultry fancier and just bred to get certain standards in the poultry shows or you just want to try and convince everyone you have 100% of somebodies bloodline. lol
    i don't know anyone or have i heard of anyone that uses 100% pure asils in the pit when showing in american gaff, mexican short knife or long knife and winning a high percentage of their fights in any major competition.their may be but i have not seen or heard of this happening.
    boles did not show pure asil cocks either,he used spanish blood ,american blood,and jap blood graded into them to make battle crosses.Bobby Boles was known to have many ,many different crosses and grades he experimented with and used different percentages of bloodlines in his fowl for a lot of yrs. he knew it took the crosses to get them where he could win in the toughest pits and win a high percentage of his fights.
    i have seen a lot of so called 100% pure asil families that show traits of american blood or some other type of blood mixed into them if you know what to look for. look on oakridge site and if you know asils ,you will see a lot of these so called pure lines of asil that people are trying to sell that are not even close to being pure asil . but they think if they put a famous name and that almighty word pure in front of them it will make them sell faster and for large amounts of money. give me the famlies that produce winners not pure bullchit stories and that is in any breed.
    just my opinion ,calling it like i see it!
    yfis
    Last edited by scott; September 12th, 2011 at 11:10 AM.

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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    Quote Originally Posted by scott View Post
    Filamex the only thing a pure asil is good for is to make more pure asils to make 1/2 breeds or 1/4 breeds to make battle cocks.
    i don't care if they are 100% pure asil. i want a bloodline that makes the best crosses,so what if it has american,jap or any other blood bred into them in their make-up,as long as they produce winners.that is what cock fighting is all about is producing [winning] fowl in the pit. unless you are a poultry fancier and just bred to get certain standards in the poultry shows or you just want to try and convince everyone you have 100% of somebodies bloodline. lol
    i don't know anyone or have i heard of anyone that uses 100% pure asils in the pit when showing in american gaff, mexican short knife or long knife and winning a high percentage of their fights in any major competition.their may be but i have not seen or heard of this happening.
    boles did not show pure asil cocks either,he used spanish blood ,american blood,and jap blood graded into them to make battle crosses.Bobby Boles was known to have many ,many different crosses and grades he experimented with and used different percentages of bloodlines in his fowl for a lot of yrs. he knew it took the crosses to get them where he could win in the toughest pits and win a high percentage of his fights.
    i have seen a lot of so called 100% pure asil families that show traits of american blood or some other type of blood mixed into them if you know what to look for. look on oakridge site and if you know asils ,you will see a lot of these so called pure lines of asil that people are trying to sell that are not even close to being pure asil . but they think if they put a famous name and that almighty word pure in front of them it will make them sell faster and for large amounts of money. give me the famlies that produce winners not pure bullchit stories and that is in any breed.
    just my opinion ,calling it like i see it!
    yfis
    Thanks Scott. I would just like to point out when you use "or" in your first sentence where you said," ....pure asils to make 1/2 or 1/4 breeds to make battle cocks." That connecting word "or" between 1/2 and 1/4 makes your statement sound like you can also make 1/4 battle cocks from pure asils which is wrong. 1/4 asil grades are made out of 1/2 asil grades, right?
    Anyway, after propagating your asil grades for a long time now, would you trust your 1/2 asils to produce your battle fowls of 1/2, 3/8, 1/4 then 1/8 asil grades? See, if you say, yeah I trust them then, what's the point now of keeping the pure ones(asils) specially if you're not gonna breed to sell or give them away. This is where my weird thought came about. Is their any truth about it? What do you think?

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    Re: Boles Brothers aseel crosses

    [QUOTE=FILAMEX;3832166]Thanks Scott. I would just like to point out when you use "or" in your first sentence where you said," ....pure asils to make 1/2 or 1/4 breeds to make battle cocks." That connecting word "or" between 1/2 and 1/4 makes your statement sound like you can also make 1/4 battle cocks from pure asils which is wrong. 1/4 asil grades are made out of 1/2 asil grades, right?
    Anyway, after propagating your asil grades for a long time now, would you trust your 1/2 asils to produce your battle fowls of 1/2, 3/8, 1/4 then 1/8 asil grades? See, if you say, yeah I trust them then, what's the point now of keeping the pure ones(asils) specially if you're not gonna breed to sell or give them away. This is where my weird thought came about. Is their any truth about it? What do you think?[/QUOTE
    you should keep breeding the brood stock on both sides that you used to make the 1/2 breeds ,because one day the 1/2 breeds will be to old to breed and then you must replace them with new 1/2 breeds and if they prove to be very good at producing brood stock you will have all the bloodlines you need to make them. you may also want to cross different bloodlines when making half breeds.sorry you misunderstood about the 1/2 breeds and 1/4 breeds ,i just assumed that every one with a little breeding experience knew you made 1/4 breeds from 1/2 breeds . there is no need in keeping a large amount of the pure asils if you do not intend to sell or give away the pure asils. just keep enough to maintain the bloodline. i don't personally like to use brood cocks over 5 or 6 yrs old unless i have no other choice. i breed every mating to try and improve the bloodlines i am working with. yfis

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