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Thread: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

  
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    Question questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Hi yall,
    i know very little about game cocks outside two great movies. cock fighter which i actually owned in vhs and the french film No Fear No die. both were excellent films that can stand alone on their own merits even if you're not a cocker imho.

    i know a fair bit about game dogs = Bulldogs = A.P.B.T.

    so anyway here are a few ?'s i have.

    What are the best ways to check = game test/match cocks without them having such a good chance of getting killed ?

    as i watch matches i see birds that seem to be good and don't want to quit just get killed with one blow. i get the fact that it's always going to be a winner.

    i get that you/we want to see how 1 cock does his thing against birds like him as well as ones that have a very different style than him too,i get that easily.

    So, my question is motivated by wanting to be able to keep a damn good bird alive and not have all the work, love and time put into one wasted in 1 quick blow.

    Now, i have heard the argument made over using blades and such to make the fight shorter. Yet, in my mind if you are there to see the best they can do and how game they are too i would want to see a longer match imho.

    I also think why don't cockers set criteria on who's wining without the cock having to die to prove a win. Yes, i know some losers survive but that's not my point.

    It's pretty easy to save a game dog who is just getting out dogged in the pit but shows no quit in him/her. I always wonder why cockers don't do that as much or why some don't do it at all.

    i know there are folks who don't use the killing blades so why is that way of which there are quite a few not something most of the cockers use?

    thanks for suffering with me lol. i love game beasts and not opposed to them being contested. i just think more in terms of how to strike a better balance that favors the survival of the beasts used in combat especially the good game ones. Dead game just ain't functional you dig? if that beasts is not a proven brood beast then all u get is a great animal that's dead and they can't help you win nor in the breeding aspect to further your breeding.
    program.

    as much as i like game cocks. my heart couldn't take losing them so often frankly. i can't make a separation in my heart caring about them just because i know that combat is dangerous and can be fatal.

    i see a bird doing great and the next split second it's like oh **** he's done.
    i am torn in two directions both for the winner and the loser. ijs smdh lol

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    ok so i saw a thread that spoke on naked heel. which i now know is what i'm speaking of basically. yet i saw this post too that made me think sure, why not compromise between naked heel and blades.

    January 31st, 2006, 06:42 AM
    dbm174

    what about something in between.....let's say a shortknife.....were fights may last a little bit longer than l/k....and give us more chance of seeing and observing the conditioning and stamina of our warriors..........

    if i'm not mistaken this has been discussed and proposed by boy diaz and emoy g. while i was watching previous WSC dvds........

    it might be a better gauge of gameness also..........jmho.....:smoke:


    then another point that aligns with my idea of a crap shoot result based.

    July 1st, 2007, 11:46 PM
    pontengwhite





    Re: Cocks should be fought as God intended....Naked Heel!

    In my own opinion, in NAKED HEEL, the element of LUCK is very small as as compared to the KNIFE. In naked heel you will see WHO BETTER CONDITION his roosters...more skill in conditioning is involved.

    Pontengwhite


    ironchef said
    "I do not favor fighting the naked heels....fighting with weapons are the true test for gameness, bottom and mettle of our breeds...those who couldn't make it past the steel blade are culled readily under this process...fighting in the naked heels defines the true meaning of cruelty....let us do the fighting and culling in the quick and easy painless manner! sultada pa rin!"




    I realize the ironchef's position is quite prevalent. yet, it makes wonder why human agendas are often so uncompromising. Some believe what irdon chef does in their hearts. while others really don't care and just like the action/$$ and don't have true love for the birds.













    Last edited by Taiji Bulldog; September 17th, 2017 at 03:09 AM.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    The only sport that your going to have large percentage of both birds surviving is Tapeboxing. Tapeboxing is for Asian Gamefowl and is more like watching two good Bulldogs go at it. There are lots of KOs with the bigger birds. You may not like the looks of them compared to the elegant American Gamecock but they are more to what you describe.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    hi man i also have game dogs my uncle is rebel kennels from back in the day but the chickens are nothing like game dogs not to me

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Why in hell would you want to save a loser, so you can breed more just as sorry or what?
    I don't get.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    From back in the days when we could fight I will answer you a bit. In my opinion the gaff is the best game for a Gamecocks test for all things. Losers do however rarely survive. It is a very different game that dogs because the partisipants are WAY different. A Gamecock for instance could be raised in complete isolation and NEVER see another rooster for two years and the minuet he sees another Cock its Game on. They have a born in hatred for another Cock. Dogs are not like that. Chickens are not a sentient creature. They don't understand whats going on like a dog does. As an example you could cut off a chickens foot and throw him down to eat with some hens and he would just eat like nothing happened not so a dog.

    Now in my opinion the Knife is a gamblers thing mostly. Some will disagree an that's fine, But the Gaff requires a lot more work and dedication and overall more consistant birds. Normaly once a bird is fought in the knife he is done no matter the outcome because of the damage sustained. But Really Dogs an Gamecocks are Nothing alike.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Sorry but this question is bunny humper 101.
    First off your looking at an individual bird. We are proud of the family of fowl. Sure we have pride in outstanding individuals but it is for the family that we test.
    Its this way of thinking that separates hunters from non hunters. Some people will never understand that.
    Back when legal we competed in derbies. With so many people having an interest in the pot you can't pick up a bird until all counts are completed. If you could people would just pick up their bird to assure their buddy gets in the money thus cutting each winners share.
    None of this matters anymore since can't test but if we could I would not carry a loser home. But if you just want him to lay in your lap while you watch Oprah thats up to you.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    I should make them watch a video of animal police showing up and destroying everything they know and the individual birds together in mass..

    that way if the (sush) shows up the birds have a chance..

    Because
    "Oh poor bird, let me euthanize you all" no winners all losers all the time, the love for the fowl the path thevision The Dream but ol **** and jesse jackson showed up. with tax dollars they rid the world of the rare things that actually have substance and require character instead we allow substance abuse where the character becomes a pawn a tool and more tax money to save the problem..


    what im saying is let a "Free man live his life" nobody had a right to dictate how our Forefathers lived... Cause when that happened the police were not the guys they called.. I doubt the police wouldve thrown tea in the harbor.. Or showed up to hold off indians..or hunt em down.



    And I agree dogs arent like roosters.. A manfighting dog is alot worst than a manfighting rooster.

    But neither is every man the same oh ok we are equal but still different oh im me your you, you cant be me, im me?
    Whos going to be you, when your me?
    Cause im not going to be.
    Last edited by CA whitetoppy06; September 17th, 2017 at 09:44 AM.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    It's not as common with the bulldogs as with fowl. But there are families of gamedogs born with a hatred toward other dogs, and anything with four legs for that matter.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    You go to a derby all birds are game. The dog match you might see a couple. Our Game and the dog peoples game is not the same. I got into the dogs a little. My research was that over the last 40 years. Only a handful of dogs was real Game winners. Many of those had lost fights also. Back in the day go to one good gaff derby and see game all day long from every bird. So I concluded Game Fowl are natural Game and been a Cocker ever sense.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    For me. Its really different. I love my dogs. They are like my friend. Chickens. They are like my hobby. Back
    home. No dog would messed around my husky. Here I got a pyrenes dog guarding my chickens. I love them. Chickens wants to fight. Dogs want to served.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by Taiji Bulldog View Post
    Hi yall,
    i know very little about game cocks outside two great movies. cock fighter which i actually owned in vhs and the french film No Fear No die. both were excellent films that can stand alone on their own merits even if you're not a cocker imho.

    i know a fair bit about game dogs = Bulldogs = A.P.B.T.

    so anyway here are a few ?'s i have.

    What are the best ways to check = game test/match cocks without them having such a good chance of getting killed ?

    as i watch matches i see birds that seem to be good and don't want to quit just get killed with one blow. i get the fact that it's always going to be a winner.

    i get that you/we want to see how 1 cock does his thing against birds like him as well as ones that have a very different style than him too,i get that easily.

    So, my question is motivated by wanting to be able to keep a damn good bird alive and not have all the work, love and time put into one wasted in 1 quick blow.

    Now, i have heard the argument made over using blades and such to make the fight shorter. Yet, in my mind if you are there to see the best they can do and how game they are too i would want to see a longer match imho.

    I also think why don't cockers set criteria on who's wining without the cock having to die to prove a win. Yes, i know some losers survive but that's not my point.

    It's pretty easy to save a game dog who is just getting out dogged in the pit but shows no quit in him/her. I always wonder why cockers don't do that as much or why some don't do it at all.

    i know there are folks who don't use the killing blades so why is that way of which there are quite a few not something most of the cockers use?

    thanks for suffering with me lol. i love game beasts and not opposed to them being contested. i just think more in terms of how to strike a better balance that favors the survival of the beasts used in combat especially the good game ones. Dead game just ain't functional you dig? if that beasts is not a proven brood beast then all u get is a great animal that's dead and they can't help you win nor in the breeding aspect to further your breeding.
    program.

    as much as i like game cocks. my heart couldn't take losing them so often frankly. i can't make a separation in my heart caring about them just because i know that combat is dangerous and can be fatal.

    i see a bird doing great and the next split second it's like oh **** he's done.
    i am torn in two directions both for the winner and the loser. ijs smdh lol
    A well bred bull dog and a well bred gamecock have similarities.

    The contests are the difference in most ways. If dog pitters were not accepting of a dog that quit because he was tired or gassed out...they would end up with very few keepers. But I think back in the day there were men that accepted and made excuses for his dog quitting. Or the dog won on bite alone and never showed if he was game to the end. There were also men that held a very high standard on pit dogs being "proven" game before breeding from them. Males and females. Different than cockfighting. The sport of dog fighting is something I was involved in for a time. I had very well bred bloodlines and they performed as they should. But the odds of the dog contest reaching the level that demands 2 hours or more of non stop combat from both was much less usual than in say a gaff contest.
    If you are sensitive to loosing a cock in competition then I would suggest that you just raise them for the fun of having and messing with them! As a hobby. But if the gameness is what draws you to the sport than you have a conflict!
    There is a time in any competitive cockers life where he wished like hell the prize cock he loved so much would have survived...a yard fight, a derby fight or whatever. But it keeps you focused on being better than the opponent. You learn from the loss and keep moving forward. The bloodlines become important and they survive and improve as you compete and learn from your experiences in the pit.
    Or if you loose your aces regular you redefine ACE Just an opinion of a poultry fancier, take it for what its worth!

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Well thought out and an outstanding response danitor!!

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by grey/dom View Post
    For me. Its really different. I love my dogs. They are like my friend. Chickens. They are like my hobby. Back
    home. No dog would messed around my husky. Here I got a pyrenes dog guarding my chickens. I love them. Chickens wants to fight. Dogs want to served.
    I agree very Well Said..... I show chickens and my dog is an extension of my family. She protects my Gamefowl that's her Job

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    For one, you can never be sure till the end. Second if he looses he wasn't as good as his match.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    I feel like the first post had to much sympathy in general for a rooster man or a dog man.... only met a few dog men in my life but they had less give a damn to em than any folks i had met before.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Either way you can't compare, the Gamecock and dog are two different creatures...... bred for 2 very different purposes

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by danitor View Post
    A well bred bull dog and a well bred gamecock have similarities.

    The contests are the difference in most ways. If dog pitters were not accepting of a dog that quit because he was tired or gassed out...they would end up with very few keepers. But I think back in the day there were men that accepted and made excuses for his dog quitting. Or the dog won on bite alone and never showed if he was game to the end. There were also men that held a very high standard on pit dogs being "proven" game before breeding from them. Males and females. Different than cockfighting. The sport of dog fighting is something I was involved in for a time. I had very well bred bloodlines and they performed as they should. But the odds of the dog contest reaching the level that demands 2 hours or more of non stop combat from both was much less usual than in say a gaff contest.
    If you are sensitive to loosing a cock in competition then I would suggest that you just raise them for the fun of having and messing with them! As a hobby. But if the gameness is what draws you to the sport than you have a conflict!
    There is a time in any competitive cockers life where he wished like hell the prize cock he loved so much would have survived...a yard fight, a derby fight or whatever. But it keeps you focused on being better than the opponent. You learn from the loss and keep moving forward. The bloodlines become important and they survive and improve as you compete and learn from your experiences in the pit.
    Or if you loose your aces regular you redefine ACE Just an opinion of a poultry fancier, take it for what its worth!
    Pretty Close only a few points on certain things I see alil different on. And there's not a single pedigree on any bulldog I can't show you a cur in! Probably several but that doesn't change the fact they produced far better than themselves which is why there in the pedigree.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by hitmonkey 2 View Post
    hi man i also have game dogs my uncle is rebel kennels from back in the day but the chickens are nothing like game dogs not to me
    Who was your uncle I knew all 4 members of Rebel Kennel's Ricky? Bulldog P? Etc

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by GA OUTLAW View Post
    Who was your uncle I knew all 4 members of Rebel Kennel's Ricky? Bulldog P? Etc

    Sent from my Z963VL using Tapatalk
    "WAS" and in 2017 "IS"..........??????? I call a little bs on a few posts on this thread "G".....starting with the OP.... LOL.........
    how long before someones tells how they get their "dead game" dogs bred.......
    Last edited by Crazy Eyes; August 7th, 2018 at 06:55 PM.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by southernX View Post
    For one, you can never be sure till the end. Second if he looses he wasn't as good as his match.
    I like this response. I've been in fights down from the first pitting, beat on for an hour or more and either kill the opponent out right or win on gameness. That is the reason we go to the end and don't try to make the rules for a fast happy contest. That why we call them game fowl. And not simply fighting chickens.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by Crazy Eyes View Post
    "WAS" and in 2017 "IS"..........??????? I call a little bs on a few posts on this thread "G".....starting with the OP.... LOL.........
    how long before someones tells how they get their "dead game" dogs bred.......
    By was I'm talking about while there was a Rebel Kennel's because ME & Mr Louie V we bought all that was left when they sold out which is why me & crazy canuc & Louie where the only ones still campaigning that blood direct until I bought out Louie & Crazy Canuc ran out of it now I am only one left with it straight from stephano , bad Becky etc I know I've seen a few claim to have it but that's not true in any aspect! Ricky snitched out everybody & now is into gamefowl & lives in KY but I'd warn anyone that ( Ricky Jones ) is a Rat & to stay away from the RAT & Kevin Thomas is the same kinda RAT that just got out in FLA from everything from being a woman beating peice of **** to a junky! That Talk's)

    I would rather in lighten those that don't know to look for themselves if posting that info to protect others is a problem please forgive me! I felt like y'all should know

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    A few came this way over the years lol...........................


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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Dang they try and put us in jail down here if we put a dog on a chain anymore!! I've already had my warning and 60 days to comply

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdslayer86 View Post
    Dang they try and put us in jail down here if we put a dog on a chain anymore!! I've already had my warning and 60 days to comply
    Yes sir that's crazy a chain is the most secure way to keep a dog. 10x10 kennel which is one of the biggest you see unless you buy extension panels of course is only 33 square feet of space a 10 foot chain is 333 square feet of space!

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Quote Originally Posted by Crazy Eyes View Post
    A few came this way over the years lol...........................

    Looks lik3 a good Eli bred dog we use to have.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    I hear you I prefer a chain but I have to follow the rules. Our pounds are run by the sheriffs department down here to luckily I got a good ole boy and he agreed with me as he kept his on chains as well but we all have to comply have me 60 days and never came back to check. My bulldog stays in the house so no worries with her just wish she wasn't a grade bitch.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    Lil youngster is just a young pup & his parents tied that made him.Whole lotta good dog's very up close & personal in him
    Some of the heaviest Kemmers Macho dog's up top & all the best of Mr Doucets blood on bottom.Which are all closely related.

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    I like the look of that bitch!!

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    Re: questions form a dog man who don't know this world of game cocks

    I like the look of that bitch!!
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