Pointing

[chip001]

Originally Posted by Good Game

When I say that the roosters did not perform well I mean that they are not moving around or breaking up on another rooster like they do at home, they are standing around, ducking, dull, and lacking that killer instinct. At home they are breaking up about 4-5 feet and whipping their legs at the other bird with good timing and direction. Then at the show it like they are just going through the motions. They jump up about 2 feet with their chest out and legs motion less, just waiting to get cracked.

I know what you are talking about. almost as if they didnt want to hurt the other rooster. when spared they just want to polverize them.

[kemosabe]

Originally Posted by Good Game

When I say that the roosters did not perform well I mean that they are not moving around or breaking up on another rooster like they do at home, they are standing around, ducking, dull, and lacking that killer instinct. At home they are breaking up about 4-5 feet and whipping their legs at the other bird with good timing and direction. Then at the show it like they are just going through the motions. They jump up about 2 feet with their chest out and legs motion less, just waiting to get cracked.

did you use any stimulate? some are better for cooler weather than others....its best to use nothing.....but to each his own.....i seen good cocks ruined (when legal) using certain products.....

[Bigjohnson1977]

Okay here we go, I am no expert or a legend! What I am is a God fearing country boy who loves his family first, then my game fowl, I have spent my whole life with them so what I do I do from past experience. 1) good brood fowl 2) 365/24/7 health 3) maintenance feed around 16% protien for show fowl & plenty of green grass, clean water 4) no parasites 5) good selection-knowing what cocks feel the best and spar the best 6) conditioning start by working up to a point then stay there for second week next at start of last week cut work in half everyday until rest period. I like to work up to 40 flies morning and evening stay there for a week then on Mon. Of last week 20 Tues. 10 Wed. 5 Thurs. Fri. Rest, Rest, Rest. 7) keep feed around 16-17% protien up until Day 18 Day 18 add extra 20% corn example if you mix 20tbs feed for 10 cocks add extra 4tbs corn Day 18. Day 19 extra 40% day 20 extra 60%. No feed last day until they become empty. Also during conditioning period I mix for 10 cocks 1Tbs buttermilk 1Tbs Yogurt 1Tbs orange Juice 1 leaf lettuce 1 Tbs canned peas 1Tbs canned carrots(diced) 1tsp Clovite powder 1tsp Wheat Germ 1strawberry 1Tbs blackberries & a pinch ceyenne pepper a pinch cinnamon put in blender until a pulp then pour over 2tbs grain mixture per cock so add 20tbs grain to pulp stir and feed 2 heaping Tbs per cock in the morning up until day 18. In the evening add couple pieces of tuna in soybean oil, 1 peeled stewed tomato, 2Tbs prune juice add this to morning pulp blend then add 2 Tbs grain per cock feed 2Tbs per cock. Also on evening feed I cook pearled barley then soak in PET milk I put 1tsp per cock & 1/3 boiled egg white soaked in water for at least 12 hours before feeding. Also I add 1/4 tsp of Conditioner!! Powder to each cocks evening feed last two weeks. Give Cod liver oil gel cap last 10 days. Give 1/2 cc b-12 b complex twice a week last time night before show.This is the way I feed them until day 18, day 18 start adding corn(cracked corn or popcorn) continue putting pearled barley and egg white on evening feed. Starting on Day 19 rest day morning feed 1 1/2 Tbs evening 1 1/4 Tbs Day 20 morning feed 1Tbs evening 1Tbs keep water in front them until show day. Show day after they brown out and drop out until it is white about size of a dime with bubbles and you know they are as sharp as they can get give 1 peck pearled barley in Pet milk that I fed during conditioning period. THIS IS IMPORTANT give 1 peck or grain of pearled barley every hour on the hour. If when you get to show they are a little wet simply drop them out every 45 minutes or so to get the extra moisture out of them. This depends a lot on the weather. In Conclusion this is what I use after years of trial and error IT USED to work for me when it was legal here, it may work for you. Try it and let me know, if you have any questions pm me. Hope you enjoy May God Bless!

[jungold]

[QUOTE=Bigjohnson1977;4154643]Okay here we go, I am no expert or a legend! What I am is a God fearing country boy who loves his family first, then my game fowl, I have spent my whole life with them so what I do I do from past experience. 1) good brood fowl 2) 365/24/7 health 3) maintenance feed around 16% protien for show fowl & plenty of green grass, clean water 4) no parasites 5) good selection-knowing what cocks feel the best and spar the best 6) conditioning start by working up to a point then stay there for second week next at start of last week cut work in half everyday until rest period. I like to work up to 40 flies morning and evening stay there for a week then on Mon. Of last week 20 Tues. 10 Wed. 5 Thurs. Fri. Rest, Rest, Rest. 7) keep feed around 16-17% protien up until Day 18 Day 18 add extra 20% corn example if you mix 20tbs feed for 10 cocks add extra 4tbs corn Day 18. Day 19 extra 40% day 20 extra 60%. No feed last day until they become empty. Also during conditioning period I mix for 10 cocks 1Tbs buttermilk 1Tbs Yogurt 1Tbs orange Juice 1 leaf lettuce 1 Tbs canned peas 1Tbs canned carrots(diced) 1tsp Clovite powder 1tsp Wheat Germ 1strawberry 1Tbs blackberries & a pinch ceyenne pepper a pinch cinnamon put in blender until a pulp then pour over 2tbs grain mixture per cock so add 20tbs grain to pulp stir and feed 2 heaping Tbs per cock in the morning up until day 18. In the evening add couple pieces of tuna in soybean oil, 1 peeled stewed tomato, 2Tbs prune juice add this to morning pulp blend then add 2 Tbs grain per cock feed 2Tbs per cock. Also on evening feed I cook pearled barley then soak in PET milk I put 1tsp per cock & 1/3 boiled egg white soaked in water for at least 12 hours before feeding. Also I add 1/4 tsp of Conditioner!! Powder to each cocks evening feed last two weeks. Give Cod liver oil gel cap last 10 days. Give 1/2 cc b-12 b complex twice a week last time night before show.This is the way I feed them until day 18, day 18 start adding corn(cracked corn or popcorn) continue putting pearled barley and egg white on evening feed. Starting on Day 19 rest day morning feed 1 1/2 Tbs evening 1 1/4 Tbs Day 20 morning feed 1Tbs evening 1Tbs keep water in front them until show day. Show day after they brown out and drop out until it is white about size of a dime with bubbles and you know they are as sharp as they can get give 1 peck pearled barley in Pet milk that I fed during conditioning period.


Nice one Big Johnson , very informative , Thanks....................

[kywolf]

sounds like they are going over.once their gizzard stops working then they go over,they become listless,draw up an just want to stand around.when you get them to the show drop them out until they are empty then start giving them a peck of something(your choice,whatever you prefer)once an hour on the hour.its important to continue until derby is over.

[gator]

My guess the problem is that they are too wet. The reason is that you get them empty which in turn makes them take on moisture You have 2 solutions not get so empty before show. My preference would be to start controlling humidity when you start cutting feed therefore you can get empty and on not wet. Just a nobody that never was but my two cents. Yfis gator

[mica]

Originally Posted by Good Game

When I say that the roosters did not perform well I mean that they are not moving around or breaking up on another rooster like they do at home, they are standing around, ducking, dull, and lacking that killer instinct. At home they are breaking up about 4-5 feet and whipping their legs at the other bird with good timing and direction. Then at the show it like they are just going through the motions. They jump up about 2 feet with their chest out and legs motion less, just waiting to get cracked.

Sir your roosters MAYBE nervous. They lack mental conditioning. Especially when you condition your roosters on the farm They lack exposure to different noises, colors and different people. And maybe you cage them only the last 3-4 days before fight. They were anxious dont know what to do inside the pit since for them its a new world. And dont forget the lightings, tha aircons...Sir these are just my opinions. Hope this could help. Good luck.

[gaff]

I was thinking lights also. If its night or in a dark space make sure his eyes have adjusted to the lights.

[GG Crasher]

maybe during conditioning your birds is not use to lights in the evening and when they get into the pit they're stranger about the day lights around darkness with the crowds..

[jordz]

uppppp.............

[H.O.T]

Hey what's up have you gotten any help.

Heres what I do. 6-weeks before derby de-louse and de-worm. Begin working them lightly just to get them used to being handled. Don't be rough. Missing or broken feathers us a huge disadvantage. They provide balance and control of their body. 4-weeks till derby start conditioning. I run them for 15 seconds and increase it by 5 seconds everyday up to a week before derby. I also fly them 10 times and increase it by 5 times everyday until a week before derby. I have 4 fly pens. One with loose dirt another with clean sand and two with coastal hay. They're rotated daily after their workout. 3-weeks before derby I start giving vitamins up until 2 days before derby. I feed high protein feed mixed with white of boiled egg about 30 minutes after workout in cups. Once a week I give them a tablespoon of sardines. I rest them Saturday spar them Sunday and rest again on Monday. That's the time I get to experiment on pointing them. What seems to work for my roosters is half feed Saturday evening. I take the water away Saturday night. Sunday morning I drop them out just as if I was at the derby in and out of keep stalls till about noon. The whole time I'm watching thier droppings. They always start out normal and decrease as the day progresses. If they start out to wet i.e they splatter i'll give them 3 pieces of corn that I crack right then and there with my teeth. If the drop too dry i.e it's hard I'll give them 3 pecks of water. If their dropping just right early in the morning I'll give them 3 pieces of cracked corn and a raisin that I cut in half. I'll spare them when they start dropping white bubbly looking crap. That means their gut is completely empty. You'll also notice that they're quite still but their eyes and head move a lot. That's when they're on point. I'll bill them good but take care cause they can blind each other. I let them go from the 8 feet and let them break twice. Break them up set them 8 feet apart again and let them break again. Don't let them get into it. Take care of the feathers. Remember that's their balance and control. I also have someone record the whole thing and I'll watch it in slow motion. That helps in culling the ones that aren't cutting. Luckily I don't have that problem often. You can tell which are cutting cause they hit straight to the chest and if they're connecting the kicks they'll throw each other back a few feet. It looks awesome. Kinda like looking at a pile of money. Take it easy I hope this helps. Oh yeah 3 days before derby start adjusting the feed to lower the protein and raise the carbohydrates by adding freshly cracked corn. A week before derby start easing up on their workout. No work the last 3 days just rest them but keep them from getting bored. By the way I hope we meet in the pit sometime I love going against the best there is. It lets me know I'm on the right track.

[Good Game]

Originally Posted by gator

My guess the problem is that they are too wet. The reason is that you get them empty which in turn makes them take on moisture You have 2 solutions not get so empty before show. My preference would be to start controlling humidity when you start cutting feed therefore you can get empty and on not wet. Just a nobody that never was but my two cents. Yfis gator

I am thinking it's something along these lines. because like i said some of these roosters have been to shows and won before. They have been exposed to the crowd, lights, noise, ect. however their droppings did not indicate that they were too wet. ?????????????????? I just dont know, such a challenge this sport of ours.

[David Dunn]

Always point with cracked corn,honey,a little buttermilk enough to moisten feed and boiled egg whites start cutting feed 3days before fightsay if d-day is sat i normally feed about 4oz a day so on wed 3/4 or 3oz 1/2 in morn 1/2 in evening put in dark boxes thur morn drop out every 4 hrs massage legs and check droppings if to dry add moisture to evening feed if to wet more cracked corn less egg whites on thur 2oz 1/2 morn1/2 evening if nice put back on roost poles at night on fri only tea spoon morning and evening drop out every 4 hrs to check moisture and massage legs make sure to put roost poles in with them in the boxes cause they will drop out better if their is a front coming you may have to cut feed even more because they will hold feed with a front coming always weigh them morn and evening when empty they will be a couple ounces lighter then their normal weights so if they are heavier then normal they are holding feed as far as moisture goes its like spagetti if it sticks to the wall its done thats about the right moisture content if its watery they are to wet if it rolls down the wall or doesnt stick they are to dry if its rainy i always run the dehumidifier and keep them in the boxes you just have to stay on top of them

[blades61]

there was a ole boy up here use to fight roundheads kept em sharp as tacks they use to ask him how he pointed em he would always say i take em out of the pen heel em up and point em in the right direction

[Good Game]

Originally Posted by blades61

there was a ole boy up here use to fight roundheads kept em sharp as tacks they use to ask him how he pointed em he would always say i take em out of the pen heel em up and point em in the right direction

Mine prolly would have done better this past week if i had used this method LOL.

[Bigjohnson1977]

Good Game can be one of two things 1) the roosters gizzards are empty you want their gut empty but not their gizzard, when their gizzard is empty they take fever. Then they start to drop out nothing but moisture or urine. What is happening is they are releasing all the moisture that was built up in their muscles. 2) or it could be they are way too wet this simply means they have been fed too much moist or wet feed. By observing their droppings you can figure out the problem if they are too wet simply feed them some pellets or toasted lite bread if they have gone over you would be better off taking them home and trying it another day. If you have already entered them in the show and they have went over I would feed them pearled barley cooked then soaked in PET milk. If show has already started I would give them a couple pecks every hour on the hour and they will start coming back around it may take a few minutes. If they are too wet I use crack corn,toast or pellets if they are too dry use cooked and soaked pearled barley and/or raisins. Hope this helps you. May God Bless

[Bigjohnson1977]

Originally Posted by blades61

there was a ole boy up here use to fight roundheads kept em sharp as tacks they use to ask him how he pointed em he would always say i take em out of the pen heel em up and point em in the right direction

My wife's cousin does same thing only thing he does is feed them 1tsp crack corn last two feedings. I been with them and won several derbies this way when it was legal here. Entry name was Redneck Gamefarm, might be same people

[Uncle Pupule]

Good one Bigjohnson, something so simple to some is hard for some. I myself used to have the same problem with roosters becoming flat at the shows until I found out my refrigerator where I rest the roosters was leaking frion. It was so embarrasing to show them as they just stood there and take hits even though they whipped their opponents at an earlier show. Not to point fingers but Karma comes when we least expect it and good fortune comes when we are respectful of others. Maybe I should go back and reread other post that reflected the knowledge of senior members that have provided sincere guidance to others as you have just provided. Thank you for your contribution.

[Good Game]

Yes, thank you to all who have offered their advice and opinions! Your help is greatly appriciated.

[hillsiderz]

I've seen good roosters get licked on fight day and so so roosters smoke on fight day. Of course a little luck on fight day is good and the bloodline and knife have to be reliable...but i think its the keep that makes you or breaks you on fight day. Particularly the pointing of them. What do you think? Anybody want to share their methods on what works and what doesn't in their personal experience? All opinions are welcome! =)

[loisbugoy]

I always come to cross this video about pointing.

Bakbakan Na! Alvin Aranez - YouTube

Bakbakan Na! Alvin Aranez - YouTube

HAPPY KASABONG....

[Razor]

Google Danny gamefowl tell u every thing u need to no

[68pkup]

that site has virus to kill your computer can you just post whats on there

Originally Posted by Razor

Google Danny gamefowl tell u every thing u need to no

[vic5.0]

Nice thread ......On Friday what time do ya give the last feeding

[jay daguio]

i like to keep my feeding time consistant!! so if i feed on the first day of my keep at 6pm then i will keep the same feeding time thru out the whole keep!! consistancy is the key to knowing how long ur fowl will hold and pass his feeding!! bt remember not all fowl will pass at their feeding at the same time, some take longer than others!!

[jailbird]

Digest all the info and practice them on your birds before an appointed sparring session. Then observe if you rooster indeed performed his best after going thru all the advise. If you have several roosters, try one method on each and see which one seems to have worked best for you and your birds. Then repeat it again several times until you are fully convinced that the method suits you. Then test it in the pit. Real time, real fights.

Remember that pointing is most crucial at the point of no return - when you release your warrior in the pit, and he is all on his own.

Have fun everyone!

[1min.shuffle]

This has been my personal belief when it comes to fighting roosters that i feel are ready to be fought. Consistency is among the top (if not top) on my list. Pointing is the most critical part of any regimen that a rooster will have to go through prior to it being let go in the pit, although there is a long chain of stages before one can finally say that what he has chosen would perform as expected (based on his preferences of course).

I'd say selection is the main key prior to everything else (which has already been a matter of discussion on one of the threads here). I do know that most of us would agree that a rooster needs to be consistent, by this I mean "consistently good" based on our standards, when it comes to skills and abilities. This we can see when we spar them regularly and this is why sparring is a vital part of the long regimen of conditioning fowls. We need a very keen eye and of course, this comes with experience.

Knowing your rooster "individually" is very important since not all of them respond equally or the same when it comes to conditioning methods and unique medication/supplement programs. They have to be treated as individuals, even full brothers might respond differently as what I have experienced years back.

Once the selection/cut-off has been made, then they undergo a pre-keep / keep stage. This is where we have to sharpen our senses more since anything "abnormal" that could happen during this period might prove to be detrimental in keeping their form come fight day. Basically, we would want them to maintain that ability when we provide them an added boost to their previous state once they enter the pre-keep/keep, which are possibly speed, power and sharpness (alertness and such).

The important thing here is it is more than just maintaining their form until the time we release them in the pit. There are a lot of techniques handed down or shared by several well known and generous cockers, however, it still boils down to what has really worked for us consistently.

[1min.shuffle]

Pointing is actually keeping your fowls sharper than how they were prior to the pre-keep/keep. This means doing some regulating....reducing-adding...completely subjective on how you "feel" what their present state is at that specific time.

My idea is basically like comparing it to a stick of dynamite when lit....I would always want them to explode (sharp, bubbly, ...just full of it) upon release. This is timing and pointing is all about getting them to this stage when they are ready to "explode" at the right time. Peaking to me can be obviously noticed....it should elevate at the right levels given a specific time frame...just like when you begin to light up a dynamite.

Just one thing, though this is just my opinion, and i am sure that most of us would also agree.....never over do things and never come up short with what needs to be done.

So, i say, we should be as sharp as our roosters during this critical stage.

[jailbird]

When released in the pit, the rooster must be aware of the enemy and ready to do battle. Not looking for food scraps to eat. Not looking for a roost to sleep in. Not wondering where he is at that time. Not gazing at the strange lights or figuring out what all that noise is all about. Pointed means just that ready to fight and pointed towards the enemy ;-)

Regarding being in tiptop physical shape and health - that's a given that should have been in him for weeks before the fight ;-)

[talisayon]

nice thread.keep posting guys..